June 30, 2010


Want an Open Relationship? Here's the How To

Long distance, managing expectations, and open relationships

Dear Savoy,

I was at the bootcamp in April with Braddock and The Don. I hesitated for a while because it's not cheap, but oh my God was it worth it and I'm kicking myself for not learning Love Systems a couple years ago. In your blog you once talked about guys who sabotage themselves because they thought they weren't rich or good-looking enough to get elite women in their life, and that was exactly me.

Now those illusions are shattered and with what I learned, I'm seriously making up for lost time. :-)

One of the women I met on my bootcamp has flown to visit me a few times (at her own expense) and I saw her when I was back in Los Angeles on business. I told "Kristine" early on that I'm not looking for a committed relationship. She said she understood, but the last couple weeks she's gotten more possessive. She asks about my female friends and is annoyed if I don't return her calls until the next day.

I feel CRAZY writing this because "Kristine" is model-quality hot and a really cool girl. She's definitely a few leagues above anyone else I dated, let alone slept with, before my bootcamp. The night we met, many other guys were hitting on her and following her around, so when she gave me her number and was excited to hear from me the next day, I thought I'd won the lottery. Now I'm also winning the lottery a lot in my home city and I don't want to be rushed into a relationship. What should I do?

- Randall S., Kansas City, MO

P.S. By the way, I have to say, the map on your website is amazing. Helped me find my bootcamp and stop making excuses like "I'll wait until Love Systems comes here one day."

Dear Randall,

Here's the first problem - you're looking at a relationship like a business contract (i.e., you and her agree on how it's going to be, and it stays that way unless you both agree to change it). That's not how most women see men and relationships.

I learned this the hard way.

In college, before Love Systems, I started dating someone just before the end of the school year. She was about to graduate and had already been accepted to law school in a college about 400 miles away. I had another year to go. Because it was a new relationship and was going to be long-distance, we agreed that it would be okay to see other people as long as we told each other when it happened.

A few months later, I somehow ended up hooking up with my friend's new roommate (hotter than any girl I'd hooked up before I started with Love Systems and started picking up seriously hot women). Thinking I was being a good boyfriend and playing by the rules, I called my girlfriend a bit later and told her.

She was REALLY pissed off.

"I thought we were past that."

Let me be clear. The rules never changed. We had that conversation about the open relationship, agreed to it, and then never discussed it again. So the same rules stay in force, right?

Not to her and not to most women in that situation. Our relationship had become pretty stable - we talked every day, saw each other most weekends, planned stuff together. So it felt like a serious relationship. In her experience, serious relationships were monogamous ones. Neither of us had been hooking up with other people (or we would have told each other about it), so to her, the relationship had evolved and now we were monogamous.

It didn't hurt that a monogamous relationship was what she naturally wanted anyway...So, what's going on here?

If you're a legal guy or have watched enough courtroom dramas on TV, you can think of how women see relationships as being "common law" instead of "civil law." In common law, rules change based on precedent. The exact same law may have the exact same wording as it did 20 years ago, but if a judge interprets those words differently than judges did 20 years ago, the law has changed. In civil law, the exact same law means the exact same thing as it always did until someone rewrites it.

Most women take a "common law" approach to relationships. To avoid "expectations drift" you need to act in a way that she perceives as "this is how a guy in an open relationship would act" and/or explicitly review the terms of your relationship. The more she wants the relationship to change, the easier it will be for her to convince herself that it has.

I go over this stuff a lot in the Relationship Management DVDs - the six major types of relationships. How to get into each, how to change relationship types, manage expectations, tell which girls will cheat and when they'll do it, and so on. That's hours of material, so I'll be brief with a couple of things to get you started on your specific question:

  • Do not see her more than once a week or once a month if long-distance. Important.

  • Make occasional comments to subtly remind her that you still have an active social life. Don't embarrass her by talking about dates or other women, but tell non-romantic stories about what happened 'when I was out last night' or 'at my friend's party on Friday.'

  • Avoid routine. Don't talk to her every day on your drive home from work, or if she lives in your town see her every Saturday night for example.

  • Realize that if she really wants an exclusive relationship and you don't give it to her, she may well find someone who does. That's okay - Love Systems is not about building a harem with every woman you meet, and if you don't want what she wants, that's okay. But be aware.

Take care,

How to pick up a Playboy Playmate

Dear Savoy,

I've been following the LSi for about a year and I just got Magic Bullets. I've usually been good with women, and now, thanks partly to you, I can pick up hot girls. But I've seen and heard about you and other Love Systems instructors with Playboy girls and I don't get it. I've never even MET a Playboy girl and from the pictures I've seen of you guys, I don't get it (no offense). If you can get 10s then so can I, so why haven't I?

- E.J., Spokane, WA

Dear E.J.,

No offense taken. As you get more experience with Love Systems (and dive into Magic Bullets) you'll realize that looks don't matter a whole lot. Yeah, they matter, but if a guy like me can date some of the most beautiful women in the world, obviously they don't matter too much. One of the big secrets, as you'll discover in Magic Bullets, is that looks for a guy have much more to do with a few fashion and grooming secrets than what you look like naked.

Speaking of "no offense," I've been to Spokane and it's a nice place with friendly people, but - no offense - it isn't exactly full of supermodels. I'm sure there are amazing women around, but for an actual Playmate, you need to go to where the Playmates actually are. Some spend time in their home towns but most seem to hang out in entertainment and fashion centers like (in the U.S.) New York, Los Angeles, and Las Vegas.

Not that these cities have a Playmate at every coffee shop, dry cleaner, and gas station. It's true that Samurai picked up a Playmate while actually teaching a Love Systems seminar in a hotel conference room, but for the most part, we have access to Playmates because we go where they go. And our relationship with the Playboy Mansion is a huge part of that.

(If you ever get a chance to go, go. It's tough to get an invite as a single guy - we only make it work because we have a relationship with one of the folks up there who knows us. We only go up there for the advanced bootcamp, and our instructors and anyone we've already trained at a regular bootcamp are cool guys who add to the party so they're good with us. Last time we went, more than half of the advanced bootcamp students took a Playboy girl home.)

Take care,


Can you use routines at parties like you do at clubs

Dear Savoy,

I know you get a lot of mail so I'll be quick. I'm 28, of Vietnamese descent, and since I was a kid I've been shy around girls, especially non-Asian girls. I read about The Routines Manual in a magazine, tried it out, and I'm hooked. It's so much easier to approach girls, even groups of hot girls, when you know exactly what to say and what to say next, and next, and next, and next...

Obviously this improved my dating life. Also, as I've met a lot of attractive, social women, I'm getting invited to a lot more events and private parties. Some are just fun, some are great places to meet more women, and some, believe it or not, are actually amazing networking opportunities for me with my career. However, I am worried that using openers from the Routines Manual (or Volume 2, which I also have now) at these parties might give me away and be embarrassing. Can you help?

- Kevin P., Chatsworth, CA

Dear Kevin,

The business/networking thing is a nice side bonus. A lot of attractive, professional women tend to collect rich and powerful people in their social circle. There are only so many women you can date at any one time, so if you turn others into friends and contacts, all the better.

Now about routines...

You're not going to want to use OPENERS from the Routines Manual at a private party. (The other 90% of the routines in the Routines Manual are fine.)

It's not because you'll "get caught." You won't, unless you've used that opener in that book before.

(We regularly use and test the routines from both The Routines Manual 1 and The Routines Manual 2. If something has gone mainstream, we replace it with a new one and send a new copy at no charge to everyone who got the original. We've done this once already with Routines Manual 1.)

It's because openers are designed to "break through" social barriers and start a normal conversation where you and her can get to know each other. At a high-end lounge where a perfect 10 is surrounded by 4 of her bitchiest girlfriends and 8 would-be suitors, you need that. At a party, you don't. She's likely to be friendly and want to get to know you too - after all, you obviously move in the same circles and know people in common.

(If you're really nervous, ask the host or the person who invited you to introduce you to her. Done.)

Now, everything past the first chapter of the Routines Manual - all the routines you'd use to create attraction, to make her chase you, to build comfort, to escalate physically, to get her alone and back to your place - those still work just fine. Just don't use the same routine twice in any given social circle.

And, as always, remember that while routines are invaluable, they're like going "all in" in poker. Not because they're risky, but because good players spend more time waiting and directing the situation for the ideal moment to go all in / use a great routine than just going for it every chance you get.

Let's say a woman I'm talking to says that her family is from Ireland, and I know I have a great routine about foreign travel. I could use it right away, but it might not be fully effective. So I'll draw the conversation out a bit, and ideally I'll get her to ask a question that is directly responded to in my routine. I might ask her if she still has relatives in Ireland, whether she's been there herself, whether she likes to travel, and so on. At some point in that conversation, she is bound to ask me whether I've traveled anywhere or like to travel. THEN I let the routine fly.

Take care,

Nick Savoy

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